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Why jesus is not the messiah for the jews?
#31
Oh my God. What a messy way to think. Can you really think that Moses would write in such ways as to completely hide the most important event in history? Give me a break. This is pattern-recognition backfiring.
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#32
(11-29-2020, 09:28 AM)Jason wrote: Oh my God. What a messy way to think. Can you really think that Moses would write in such ways as to completely hide the most important event in history? Give me a break. This is pattern-recognition backfiring.

Especially since there are so many very clear passages throughout the entire Hebrew bible that speak of a human redeemer from the line of David.
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#33
Shabbat Shalom to those concerned.  Thank you Jason and searchinmyroots for your response.  King David prayed for HaShem to:  "Open Thou mine eyes, that I may behold wondrous things out of Thy Torah."  To those who have "unopened" eyes, it may appear to be "messy," and "hidden," but those who are blessed to behold those wondrous things out of The Torah, they will BEGIN to see much more than what the Foundation of the Torah (the ritual of the red heifer) has hidden within it.

Take for example the New Moon. HaShem declared that when the Children of Israel were in the process of leaving Egypt, that it was the BEGINNING of their MOONS (months - Exo 12:2).  So this was in a symbolic sense, a New Moon when they came forth out of Egypt.  Consider the symbolism.  You have a people leaving Egypt (a symbol of hard bondage-iniquity Isa 1:4), and they are told that in relation to the world, they are but a small sliver of people that Elohim has elevated ABOVE all the peoples on the face of the earth: Deut 7:6-7 “For you are a set-apart people to יהוה your Elohim. יהוה your Elohim has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a treasured possession above all the peoples on the face of the earth. 7“יהוה did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more numerous than any other people, for you were the least of all peoples, 

Isn't that what a New Moon is?  It is a BODY that is ABOVE all the peoples on the face of the earth, and for it to be a New Moon, it starts out as just a small sliver (least of all peoples).  Those who left Egypt were just a small sliver of mankind.  And what did they do?  They were given LIGHT, were they not?  Prov 6:23  For the command is a lamp, And the Torah a light, And reproofs of discipline a way of life,  Yes, the Torah is a LIGHT, and it was given to the Children of Israel for them to REFLECT upon the face of the earth....just as the physical moon reflects the light of the sun upon the face of the earth.

Now, why would Moses be so messy and try to hide that the Children of Israel were a New Moon, reflecting the Torah upon this earth?  Can a physical moon be a symbol of a people, just like a red heifer can be a symbol of the Messiah???  Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew
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#34
Every person who thinks he has special knowledge allows himself to call everyone else "blind." I'm not convinced by such statements. My eyes are not closed just because you see things that aren't real.
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#35
Shabbat Shalom again Jason, I am sorry for you that you feel the way you do. To be sure, someone with Judaism will acknowledge and believe that the Living Water which is added to the ashes of the red heifer in the vessel, IS symbolic of Everlasting Life that was added to the dead body of the Messiah in the vessel of the tomb. And that the Children of Israel, reflecting the Light of the Torah upon this world, was a New Moon. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
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#36
Shabbat Shalom to those concerned.  Again, I must indicate that traditional and messianic christians do not grasp that the Children of Israel were a Spiritual New Moon when they left Egypt and started reflecting the Light of the Torah upon mankind.  They also do not grasp that the Messiah fulfilled the role of being the Spiritual Red Heifer when He was made to suffer, die, be buried, and then resurrected on the 3rd day just exactly as Moses wrote.  They also do not grasp the role of Hyssop in the fulfillment of what Moses wrote.  Hyssop is a reed that can be used to "sprinkle."  Hyssop had to be cast INTO the midst of the burning of the red heifer, and then hyssop was also used to sprinkle the ashes of the red heifer, which had "living water" added therein, upon the unclean.  Well, what is Spiritual hyssop?  Spiritual hyssop is "rebuke."  The rebuke can either be just or it can be unjust.  The rebuke that was cast into the midst of the Messiah's suffering was unjust, but non-the-less, it was the Spiritual hyssop that was cast INTO the suffering/burning of the Messiah.  The hyssop that was/is used to sprinkle the ashes of the red heifer/Messiah is the REBUKE to declare the suffering, death, burial, and 3rd day resurrection of the Messiah just as Moses and the Prophets wrote.  This rebuke is JUST.  The Messiah began the sprinkling of His suffering, death, burial, and 3rd day resurrection WITH hyssop, on the 2 Disciples who were traveling to Emmaus.  He then continued the sprinkling with the rest of His Disciples later that evening, and then the Disciples ALSO sprinkled the Jews in Jerusalem at Pentecost/Shavuot declaring to them that they had murdered the Holy One of Israel.  This sprinkling with hyssop (rebuke) had to occur on the 3rd and 7th days.  The Messiah had to arise on the 3rd day to sprinkle with hyssop, as Moses commanded that the sprinkling be done by a "clean man."  Everyone who participated in slaughtering the Messiah is unclean (and that is ALL of sinful mankind).  All of sinful mankind is "dead" in their sin, so ONLY One who is NOT dead could qualify to be the Spiritual Sprinkler...the resurrected Messiah.  He is the One who performs and directs the sprinkling (with hyssop), and a 7th day sprinkling MUST occur.  When do you suppose that happens?  Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
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#37
Okay, we've heard your beliefs on this several times and I think it's time to move on.

Thank you.
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#38
Shabbat Shalom searchinmyroots, I suppose I will take your advice and move on as you have rejected my interpretations.  Though, I might say that if Pharaoh and his wise men would have been foolish and slow of heart NOT to believe what the Prophet Joseph said, when he interpreted that the seven fat cows and seven good ears of corn would be seven years of abundance and plenty, then they would not have followed Joseph’s recommendation to prepare for the seven years of famine that the thin cows and thin ears of corn symbolized.  But who knows, maybe you will become like Pharaoh and see how HaShem does use symbols and interpretations to teach about things to come.  Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
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#39
I meant to move on from this thread not the forum.

But of course you are free to do what you feel is right.

I don't think I said I "rejected" your interpretations. I've read them, considered them, and think they were well thought out.

I just may not "agree" with them.
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