Prophecies

[rosends]

Could the problem actually, first and foremost, already be developed in your smug and self satisfied approach to the discussion of truth?

I seem to recall that God resists the proud, and something else about pride preceding destruction.

Covenantal obedience and it's claim on you should necessitate your faithfulness to the call of God, being a light to the gentiles. Instead, your flint like countenance no doubt repels not only gentiles, but also God Himself.

no, the problem is that you are starting with a series of limitations on your understanding and then you are getting defensive when it is pointed out that you don't know stuff. If you are repelled by the realization of your own ignorance, that sounds like a you problem.

[searchinmyroots]

Could the problem actually, first and foremost, already be developed in your smug and self satisfied approach to the discussion of truth?

I seem to recall that God resists the proud, and something else about pride preceding destruction.

Covenantal obedience and it's claim on you should necessitate your faithfulness to the call of God, being a light to the gentiles. Instead, your flint like countenance no doubt repels not only gentiles, but also God Himself.

ESchaible,

Reading your responses, I don't think you are coming to this forum with the right attitude.

You are certainly welcome to ask questions and not agree, but your tone is not acceptable.

Please refrain in future posts.

Thank you.

[ESchaible]

My apologies.

I find it interesting that, after 3 posts, a sweeping judgment can be made about my knowledge of what Torah is and is not, and really anything at all.

That aside -

What are the criteria to discount Daniel as a prophet?

My limitations are simply the truth of God, and if that is to limiting for you, than the impasse is already profoundly revealing (and slightly ironic).

[Blue Bird]

This seems good to me, an excerpt from what Rosends posted:

According to Judaism, Daniel is not one of the 55 prophets. His writings include visions of the future, which we believe to be true; however, his mission was not that of a prophet. His visions of the future were never intended to be proclaimed to the people; they were designed to be written down for future generations. Thus, they are Writings, not Prophecies, and are classified accordingly.  (emphasis by me)

Just this morning I read a chapter from Daniel. There it says:

And the vision of the evening and the morning that was said is true, and you close up the vision, which will be for many days.

Curious people like me would like to know the meaning of these prophecies and I wonder why not more people feel the same, but that's another story.

[rosends]

My apologies.

I find it interesting that, after 3 posts, a sweeping judgment can be made about my knowledge of what Torah is and is not, and really anything at all.

That aside -

What are the criteria to discount Daniel as a prophet?

My limitations are simply the truth of God, and if that is to limiting for you, than the impasse is already profoundly revealing (and slightly ironic).

your claim about the "truth of God" is your personal sense of things that you are mistaking for a transcendent fact.

[ESchaible]

I am profoundly interested in Daniels prophecies, and have spent a good deal of time with them.

I can't discount prophetic scripture simply because men tell me to. I would like to know, from God, not men, why Daniel is not considered a prophet.

Rosends,

I am bound to scripture, as you should be.

[searchinmyroots]

I guess my question is -

Are any of the prophets actually called prophets in the Hebrew bible?

Is Daniel ever called a prophet in the Hebrew bible?

[ESchaible]

There are very clear criteria, outlined plainly in scripture. But interestingly it seems the only authority pointed to this far is a man and his subjective opinion.

I can offer my thoughts as to why Daniel is rejected as a prophet. It is as it has always been - it's a pragmatic rejection based on Daniel being much to pointedly Messianic, and more than this, his prophecies make it an unequivocal fast that Messiah has already come, and when coupled with another oft rejected portion of Isaiah, make it plain that Jesus is Messiah.

Daniel is understandable only when he is interpreted in the light of the second advent of Messiah to redeem Israel and reestablish the land promised to Abraham, and upturn this world and it's corruption. Sadly, it will take Jacobs trouble to bring the nation to its knees and finally see that Jesus is Lord. This judgment is already pressing in on Israel, would to God that Jews everywhere were warned that this judgment will surpass any suffering the nation has ever known. Lift your heads, because it's obvious.

But I digress.

I would like to hear from the people on this forum and thread why THEY reject Daniel as a prophet of God - so far I have just gotten Jewish FAQ site links as responses, and insults.

There truly is nothing new under the sun.

[searchinmyroots]

Obviously this is your understanding, please don't tell us what our scriptures given to us mean.

It's amazing you think you understand the Hebrew bible more than those who know Hebrew and spent most of their lives reading it.

Every scroll, every verse, every word and every letter.

If the Jewish messiah had already come, the world wouldn't be what it is today.

That is made very clear from the writings of the prophets. Especially from Isaiah whom you say portions we reject to mean your interpretation.

Please don't proselytize here, it won't be tolerated.

Thank you.

[ESchaible]

So many assumptions, with absolutely no basis for any of them. I find it interesting that the response to my posts is to insult my intelligence with baseless claims.

If I was interested in proselytizing, I wouldn't be here. I am supremely interested in truth.

I still have yet to receive any justification for Daniels rejection.