12-01-2025, 10:28 PM
Here is a different response from a different AI. I am not evaluating either one or one against the other. I am simply illustrating that the same question asked can produce different answers even if phrased the same. I'd be very careful before simply accepting what any AI produces.
"In chapter 17 it says that the Israelites arrived at Rephidim, and in chapter 18 it says that Jethro visited Moses at the mountain of God (where they were still at Rephidim). And in chapter 19 it says they left Rephidim and arrived at the mountain of God in the desert of Sinai. So did they arrive at the mountain in chapter 17 or in chapter 19?"
Great question — you’ve spotted one of those classic “wait a second…” moments in the Exodus narrative. Let’s untangle it carefully:
? The Texts
? Scholarly Explanations
Would you like me to show you how Jewish and Christian commentators (like Rashi or Augustine) have interpreted this apparent contradiction? They each have fascinating ways of smoothing it out.
Yes
Direct Answer: Jewish commentators like Rashi explain that Jethro’s visit in Exodus 18 is not strictly chronological but anticipatory, while Christian commentators such as Augustine treat the “mountain of God” as symbolic, emphasizing spiritual meaning rather than geography. So, the Israelites literally arrive at Sinai in chapter 19, but chapter 18 uses the phrase more loosely or thematically.
? Jewish Commentary (Rashi and others)
? Reconciling the Tension
? So, the safest reading is: they literally arrive at the mountain in chapter 19, but chapter 18 uses the phrase in a thematic or symbolic way.
Would you like me to lay out a side-by-side timeline chart showing how Jewish vs. Christian traditions place Jethro’s visit (before, during, or after Sinai)? That could make the comparison crystal clear.
"In chapter 17 it says that the Israelites arrived at Rephidim, and in chapter 18 it says that Jethro visited Moses at the mountain of God (where they were still at Rephidim). And in chapter 19 it says they left Rephidim and arrived at the mountain of God in the desert of Sinai. So did they arrive at the mountain in chapter 17 or in chapter 19?"
Great question — you’ve spotted one of those classic “wait a second…” moments in the Exodus narrative. Let’s untangle it carefully:
? The Texts
- Exodus 17:1 — The Israelites camp at Rephidim, where there is no water, leading to the episode of water from the rock.
- Exodus 18:5 — Jethro comes to Moses “to the wilderness where he was encamped, at the mountain of God.”
- Exodus 19:2 — The Israelites set out from Rephidim and arrive in the wilderness of Sinai, where they camp in front of “the mountain.”
- In chapter 18, it sounds like Moses is already “at the mountain of God” while still at Rephidim.
- In chapter 19, the text explicitly says they leave Rephidim and arrive at the mountain of God in Sinai.
? Scholarly Explanations
- Narrative Compression / Anticipation
- Some scholars argue that Exodus 18 is placed thematically rather than chronologically. Jethro’s visit is told as if it happens “at the mountain of God,” anticipating the arrival in chapter 19. In other words, the phrase “mountain of God” in 18:5 may be editorial, signaling where the story is heading rather than where they literally were at that moment.
- Some scholars argue that Exodus 18 is placed thematically rather than chronologically. Jethro’s visit is told as if it happens “at the mountain of God,” anticipating the arrival in chapter 19. In other words, the phrase “mountain of God” in 18:5 may be editorial, signaling where the story is heading rather than where they literally were at that moment.
- Broader Geographic Reference
- “Mountain of God” may refer to the general region of Sinai, not just the specific peak where the covenant is given. Rephidim could be within that broader wilderness area, so Jethro’s visit is described as being “at the mountain” even though the Israelites hadn’t yet camped directly at its base.
- “Mountain of God” may refer to the general region of Sinai, not just the specific peak where the covenant is given. Rephidim could be within that broader wilderness area, so Jethro’s visit is described as being “at the mountain” even though the Israelites hadn’t yet camped directly at its base.
- Different Source Traditions
- Many biblical scholars see Exodus as weaving together multiple traditions (sometimes called J, E, P sources). One tradition places Jethro’s visit before Sinai, another after. The final text preserves both, creating the overlap you noticed.
- Many biblical scholars see Exodus as weaving together multiple traditions (sometimes called J, E, P sources). One tradition places Jethro’s visit before Sinai, another after. The final text preserves both, creating the overlap you noticed.
- Chronologically in the narrative: The Israelites don’t camp directly at Sinai until chapter 19.
- Chapter 18’s wording: Either anticipates that location, uses “mountain of God” broadly, or reflects a different tradition.
Would you like me to show you how Jewish and Christian commentators (like Rashi or Augustine) have interpreted this apparent contradiction? They each have fascinating ways of smoothing it out.
Yes
Direct Answer: Jewish commentators like Rashi explain that Jethro’s visit in Exodus 18 is not strictly chronological but anticipatory, while Christian commentators such as Augustine treat the “mountain of God” as symbolic, emphasizing spiritual meaning rather than geography. So, the Israelites literally arrive at Sinai in chapter 19, but chapter 18 uses the phrase more loosely or thematically.
? Jewish Commentary (Rashi and others)
- Rashi (11th century): He notes that Jethro came after hearing of the splitting of the Red Sea and the war with Amalek. For Rashi, the reference to the “mountain of God” in Exodus 18:5 is not a precise geographical marker but a way of situating the narrative in the broader Sinai wilderness.
- Rashbam (Rashi’s grandson): He often emphasizes the plain meaning of the text. In this case, Rashbam suggests that the Torah sometimes arranges events thematically rather than chronologically, so Jethro’s visit is told before the covenant at Sinai even if it may have occurred later.
- Other rabbinic voices: Some midrashic traditions even place Jethro’s visit after the giving of the Torah, interpreting his advice to Moses about judges as a response to the new legal system. This shows that Jewish tradition recognized the narrative “out of order” issue and offered multiple harmonizations.
? Reconciling the Tension
- Literal chronology: The Israelites arrive at Sinai only in Exodus 19.
- Exodus 18’s phrasing: Either anticipates that arrival, uses “mountain of God” broadly for the Sinai region, or reflects a different source tradition.
- Commentators’ solutions:
- Jewish: Jethro’s visit may be narrated out of order for thematic reasons.
- Christian: The “mountain” is symbolic, so the geography is secondary to the spiritual meaning.
- Jewish: Jethro’s visit may be narrated out of order for thematic reasons.
? So, the safest reading is: they literally arrive at the mountain in chapter 19, but chapter 18 uses the phrase in a thematic or symbolic way.
Would you like me to lay out a side-by-side timeline chart showing how Jewish vs. Christian traditions place Jethro’s visit (before, during, or after Sinai)? That could make the comparison crystal clear.
בקש שלום ורדפהו