09-05-2024, 12:45 PM
(This post was last modified: 10-06-2024, 10:50 AM by COmentator.)
message #3 above remarks on Punishments in the afterlife:
Absalaom
nalys
Although Absalom avenged his sister difelment by Amnon ironically he proved himself not to be very much different from Amnon. As Amon had sought the advice of Jonadab in order to rape Tamar, Absalom had sought the adivce of Ahitophel who advised Absalom to have incestious relations with his father's concubines in order to show all Israel how odious to his father [2 Samuel 16:20] .Likewise as Amonon had brought two curses on himself for incest with his half sister and failing to fulfill the Torah Law, Absalom brought four curses on himself for dishonoring his father; relations with his father's wives [concubines]; and failing to fulfill the Torah Law twice. [Deuteronomy 27:20 26] The concubines were not punished by G-d. They were violated by Absalom. Absalom with his own free will, choose to do that. It is true G-d created a world where we humans can choose good or evil, but the choice in the end remains ours. Although G-d had told David that his wives would be taken, he did not ordain or force Absalom to violate them. He just foretold it.
Is a lesson to be learned of the consequences from Absalom life is that his lust for power was so deep that he engaged in acts of chillul hashem and brought upon himself 4 curses from the Torah? (Dishonoring his father by his revolt; dishonoring his father's wives; and twice bring curses on himself for not fulfilling the Torah law)?
Yes. He was a prince who could had almost anything. The only things he wanted were things he could not have. He lusted after his sister and his father's throne.
Wealth is not determined by possessions but by mindset. In his mind, Absalom was a pauper. He only looked at what he did not have.
Amon of Judah
The opinion that Amon was the most sinful of all the wicked kings of Judah (II Chron. xxxiii. 23) is brought out in the Talmud in tractate Sanhedrin 103b) as follows: Ahaz suspended the sacrificial worship and sealed the Torah scrolls, Manasseh burned the names of the Lord and tore down the altar, Amon made it a place of desolation [covered it with cobwebs] and burned the Torah scrolls. This is derived from the story of the finding of the Book of the Law, II Kings, xxii. 8]; Ahaz permitted incest, Manasseh committed it with his sister, Amon committed it with his mother, saying to her, I only did this to anger the Creator. And yet, out of respect for his son Josiah, Amon's name was not placed on the list of the kings excluded from the world to come. The sages also explain proverbs 24:30 as follows: I passed by the field of a lazy man, This is Ahaz. And the vineyard of a senseless man, this is Manashe. And behold, it was all overgrown with thorns, this is Amon. And its surface was covered with Nettle, this is Jehoiakim. And its stone wall was broken down, this is a reference to Zedekiah, in whose days the temple was destroyed. A midrashic fragment preserved in the Apostolic Constitutions, ii. 23, which appears to follow an account of the repentance of Manasseh according to a lost Jewish apocryphal writing, reads:
"No sin is more grievous than idolatry, for it is treason against God. Yet even this has been forgiven upon sincere repentance; but he that sins from a mere spirit of opposition, to see whether God will punish the wicked, shall find no pardon, although he say in his heart, 'I shall have peace in the end (by repenting), though I walk in the stubbornness of my evil heart'" (Deut. xxix. 19). Such a one was Amon, the son of Manasseh, for the (Apocryphal) Scripture says: "And Amon reasoned an evil reasoning of transgression and said: 'My father from his childhood was a great transgressor, and he repented in his old age. So will I now walk after the lust of my soul and afterward return to the Lord.' And he committed more evil in the sight of the Lord than all that were before him; but the Lord God speedily cut him off from this good land. And his servants conspired against him and slew him in his own house, and he reigned two years only." It is noteworthy that this very midrashic fragment casts light upon the emphatic teaching of the Mishnah (Yoma, viii. 9): "Whosoever says, 'I will sin and repent thereafter,' will not be granted the time for repentance. [Jewish Encylopedia Amon King of Judah]26–527.
Jehoiakim:
Jehoiakim is still undergoing punishment for his sins. Although the Babylonian Talmud does not include him among those who have no place in the world to come (cf. Sanh. 103b), the Palestinian Talmud cites him as an example of one who has forfeited his place in heaven by publicly transgressing the law.
Absalaom
nalys
Although Absalom avenged his sister difelment by Amnon ironically he proved himself not to be very much different from Amnon. As Amon had sought the advice of Jonadab in order to rape Tamar, Absalom had sought the adivce of Ahitophel who advised Absalom to have incestious relations with his father's concubines in order to show all Israel how odious to his father [2 Samuel 16:20] .Likewise as Amonon had brought two curses on himself for incest with his half sister and failing to fulfill the Torah Law, Absalom brought four curses on himself for dishonoring his father; relations with his father's wives [concubines]; and failing to fulfill the Torah Law twice. [Deuteronomy 27:20 26] The concubines were not punished by G-d. They were violated by Absalom. Absalom with his own free will, choose to do that. It is true G-d created a world where we humans can choose good or evil, but the choice in the end remains ours. Although G-d had told David that his wives would be taken, he did not ordain or force Absalom to violate them. He just foretold it.
Is a lesson to be learned of the consequences from Absalom life is that his lust for power was so deep that he engaged in acts of chillul hashem and brought upon himself 4 curses from the Torah? (Dishonoring his father by his revolt; dishonoring his father's wives; and twice bring curses on himself for not fulfilling the Torah law)?
Yes. He was a prince who could had almost anything. The only things he wanted were things he could not have. He lusted after his sister and his father's throne.
Wealth is not determined by possessions but by mindset. In his mind, Absalom was a pauper. He only looked at what he did not have.
Amon of Judah
The opinion that Amon was the most sinful of all the wicked kings of Judah (II Chron. xxxiii. 23) is brought out in the Talmud in tractate Sanhedrin 103b) as follows: Ahaz suspended the sacrificial worship and sealed the Torah scrolls, Manasseh burned the names of the Lord and tore down the altar, Amon made it a place of desolation [covered it with cobwebs] and burned the Torah scrolls. This is derived from the story of the finding of the Book of the Law, II Kings, xxii. 8]; Ahaz permitted incest, Manasseh committed it with his sister, Amon committed it with his mother, saying to her, I only did this to anger the Creator. And yet, out of respect for his son Josiah, Amon's name was not placed on the list of the kings excluded from the world to come. The sages also explain proverbs 24:30 as follows: I passed by the field of a lazy man, This is Ahaz. And the vineyard of a senseless man, this is Manashe. And behold, it was all overgrown with thorns, this is Amon. And its surface was covered with Nettle, this is Jehoiakim. And its stone wall was broken down, this is a reference to Zedekiah, in whose days the temple was destroyed. A midrashic fragment preserved in the Apostolic Constitutions, ii. 23, which appears to follow an account of the repentance of Manasseh according to a lost Jewish apocryphal writing, reads:
"No sin is more grievous than idolatry, for it is treason against God. Yet even this has been forgiven upon sincere repentance; but he that sins from a mere spirit of opposition, to see whether God will punish the wicked, shall find no pardon, although he say in his heart, 'I shall have peace in the end (by repenting), though I walk in the stubbornness of my evil heart'" (Deut. xxix. 19). Such a one was Amon, the son of Manasseh, for the (Apocryphal) Scripture says: "And Amon reasoned an evil reasoning of transgression and said: 'My father from his childhood was a great transgressor, and he repented in his old age. So will I now walk after the lust of my soul and afterward return to the Lord.' And he committed more evil in the sight of the Lord than all that were before him; but the Lord God speedily cut him off from this good land. And his servants conspired against him and slew him in his own house, and he reigned two years only." It is noteworthy that this very midrashic fragment casts light upon the emphatic teaching of the Mishnah (Yoma, viii. 9): "Whosoever says, 'I will sin and repent thereafter,' will not be granted the time for repentance. [Jewish Encylopedia Amon King of Judah]26–527.
Jehoiakim:
Jehoiakim is still undergoing punishment for his sins. Although the Babylonian Talmud does not include him among those who have no place in the world to come (cf. Sanh. 103b), the Palestinian Talmud cites him as an example of one who has forfeited his place in heaven by publicly transgressing the law.